Do you think Gonzaga/Mirko was a fluke?

[D241]

Personally, I think Gonzaga knew of Mirko's fierce striking ability, so he trained in circling/angles so that Mirko wouldn't be able to plant his feet and find his range and timing.

Gonzaga, although young, seems like he is a smart fighter, who is working on being well rounded.

He's gaining an impressive victory list so far.

[The Juggernaut]

He imposed his will on mirko

[fightfan80]

No, i don't think it was a fluke. Gabe landed 10-15 elbows in the first round, and took it easily. Cro Crop wasn't agressive, wasn't hungry, and he got beat by someone who wanted it more. This theme seems to be playing out over and over again.

[Drunken Gamer]

CroCop's offense in the entire fight:

Punches: ZERO

Kicks: ONE


Based on that performance, I say that Dos Caras Jr should demand a rematch.

[Onion]

the way Gabe stalked Mirko and didn't allow the kicks from Mirko, due to Mirko backing up the whole time, was a great gameplan (btw, I think I typed 'Mirko' too much there)

[ChokeMeTheFout]

I think CC knocked out on his back with his leg half way up is ass=real great game plan.

[Drunken Gamer]

the way Gabe stalked Mirko and didn't allow the kicks from Mirko, due to Mirko backing up the whole time, was a great gameplan (btw, I think I typed 'Mirko' too much there)

Not one punch? And guess what? The guard can be offensive! Imagine that!

[Adam15]

Personally, I think Gonzaga knew of Mirko's fierce striking ability, so he trained in circling/angles so that Mirko wouldn't be able to plant his feet and find his range and timing.

Gonzaga, although young, seems like he is a smart fighter, who is working on being well rounded.

He's gaining an impressive victory list so far.

Vanderlei Silva circled well against Cro Cop too before Mirko LHK'ed his head into the 17th row.

Difference is that Mirko seemed comfortable then. He hasn't seemed comfortable or himself since he entered the UFC.

That being said, Gonzaga was totally focused and wanted it a lot more.

[Nemesis_BC]

Absolutely NOT a fluke.

[Drunken Gamer]

In todays issue of many Croatian newspapers Cro Cop said he is sick of everything, training, travelling, fighting. He also said every next fight could be his last. I am affraid this could be The end.

On the other hand, we Croatians are stubborn as an oxe. This could also be his motivator for another climbing from the bottom, but for the first time in last 10 years, I seriously doubt!

I believe that. CroCop just doesn't look motivated anymore. And as CBEAR said, his face has aged rapidly over the few years probably due to stress.

RIP Mirko.

[The Juggernaut]

RIP Mirko.
quoted for emphasis.

[Onion]

Not one punch? And guess what? The guard can be offensive! Imagine that!

not sure why you quoted my post when you typed this???\

[Drunken Gamer]

not sure why you quoted my post when you typed this???\

I dunno....I stayed up pretty late night and didn't get my 8 hours of sleep! :neutral:

[Onion]

I dunno....I stayed up pretty late night and didn't get my 8 hours of sleep! :neutral:

I hear that. I pulled a 20hr work day yesterday (every Friday) and I was loopy!

[Loot]

Absolutely not a fluke. Mirko got abused. He got out gameplanned, outfought, and KTFOed. It was a thing of beauty. Gonzaga won that fight flat out. This was no fluke at all.

[Dgilbert]

I believe that. CroCop just doesn't look motivated anymore. And as CBEAR said, his face has aged rapidly over the few years probably due to stress.

RIP Mirko.

the reason i'd disagree, is because of how great he looked in winning the OWGP, after he won, many a fan was saying he could now beat fedor, unless you mean since he won the OWGP then I think you might be onto something. I tend to think he just got beat.

[Drunken Gamer]

the reason i'd disagree, is because of how great he looked in winning the OWGP, after he won, many a fan was saying he could now beat fedor, unless you mean since he won the OWGP then I think you might be onto something. I tend to think he just got beat.

He looked absolutely exhausted in this fight before it began, and is it me, or is he starting to look old? Chxck looks a hell of a lot younger than Mirko and I think Chxck is actually older.

[fightfan80]

He looked absolutely exhausted in this fight before it began, and is it me, or is he starting to look old? Chxck looks a hell of a lot younger than Mirko and I think Chxck is actually older.


He looked like a man who wasn't hungry to fight, who didn't have a burning desire to fight. Gonzaga was hungry, and I believe that Gonzaga was truly burning with desire to KO Mirko.

Once you get on top/rich, how do you keep the will to go to war?

That's why I love Sakuraba. He is always hungry to win. He always leaves everything in the ring.

I agree with what you and werewolf have said before about MMA being watered down. However, the recent upsets have given me hope that people with a warrior's spirit will be able to add true excitement back to mma. Right now at least it is happening.

For every watered down AA/Werdum fight there is a Matt Serra or Sokoudjou beatdown. Hopefully soon, with all the new and emerging talent in mma, we won't have to suffer through as many boring matches.

[Dgilbert]

He looked absolutely exhausted in this fight before it began, and is it me, or is he starting to look old? Chxck looks a hell of a lot younger than Mirko and I think Chxck is actually older.

you definitely have a point with the way he looked, and the aging, I just think he got beat, and I'm not ready to write him off just yet.

[Loot]

Mirko reminded me a lot of Franklin in Franklin/Silva. He just seemed like something was off.

In any case, he got KTFOed. That was nuts. Gonzaga executed his gameplan perfectly. I am still confused. Great fight.

[Vanno]

Gonzaga just dines daily on the flesh of children, and thus is a mean son of a bitch. Also, it seems like either he is a very smart fighter, or has a damn good team behind him.

[Skinnyboy]

He looked absolutely exhausted in this fight before it began, and is it me, or is he starting to look old? Chxck looks a hell of a lot younger than Mirko and I think Chxck is actually older.

Mirko holds his emotions in. That's not good for the complexion :)

[fist]

Gonzagas vistory was real deal, no fluke at all. Great game plan, great killer instinct. Mirko was totaly outgamed. Why? His body was there but his mind who know where. He simply seems totaly uninterested for fighting business lately. Maybe its time to finish career and open his gym that he talks a lot lately where he will coach young Croatian talents and belive me, we have a lot of them!

[Serialkilla]

azlion and ChiliChris are the only ones holding on.

[Shamrocked]

I think 9 outta 10 Mirko wins, but I'd hardly call it a fluke. Gonzaga was on and Mirko was not.

[LiveinTokyo]

Said it before and I will say it again - Crocop has great physical talent but no fighting heart. Things start going badly for him and he folds like a deck chair. Good fighter, but does not have the fighting spirit to be great. I think he knows it too.

[Jay]

If the CroCop that dominated PRIDE turned up, Gonzaga wouldn't of won. I've not lost any respect for CroCop. Everybody has a bad day.

[telerion]

Gonzaga certainly was dominant in the first round, but I think if we'd gotten to a second round Mirko would have stepped up. Still Gonzaga executed a smart game plan and may have won by GnP eventually. I do think the knockout by HK was a fluke. No way he gets that again.

[NY1981]

He looked absolutely exhausted in this fight before it began, and is it me, or is he starting to look old? Chxck looks a hell of a lot younger than Mirko and I think Chxck is actually older.

Mirko is 32 or 33 and Chxck is like 37 I believe. I don't think that he will take anytime off. If he took time off I think that would be the end of Mirko.

[dhk1980]

I believe that. CroCop just doesn't look motivated anymore. And as CBEAR said, his face has aged rapidly over the few years probably due to stress.

RIP Mirko.
hey DG, you sound really heart broken. didn't u say that during the pride OWGP, u weren standing and jumping and shouting like a kid while crocop put a on a show?? well.... awwwwwwww, you poor baby! :lol:

[Dgilbert]

I think 9 outta 10 Mirko wins, but I'd hardly call it a fluke. Gonzaga was on and Mirko was not.

Yeah this is where I stand, I still think Mirko wins a high percentage against Gonzaga, but it' s not a fluke because it was udder domination, on the part of Gonzaga.

[ChokeMeTheFout]

If the CroCop that dominated PRIDE turned up, Gonzaga wouldn't of won. I've not lost any respect for CroCop. Everybody has a bad day.

Here is a little bit of reality for you Jay.CC never won PRIDE HW belt therefore did not dominate PRIDE.And don't bring up the OWGP because if Barnett and Big Nog didn't have such a war he might not have won that.

[mmafighting]

It's not a fluke if the guy is winning the round and Gonzaga was winning convincingly up until that kick.

[Iron Maiden]

Wasn't a fluke from where I was sitting. I'd just say that Mirko didn't do anything to win. It's like he really didn't want to fight last night and Gonzaga did. I think the losses to Randleman and Fedor destroyed him anyway. He has never been the same since those losses. Props to Gonzaga,he looked 100x better than he did in that **** fest fight I last saw him in.

I admit,it was fun watching Mirko get KTFO. I've said this and argued it on this forum many times before,but Mirkos stand up is cocky,and he can easily get caught at any point. The man is just way too cocky,and it bit him in the ass this time.

Mirko deserved to get a taste of his own medicine,and he did. Now learn some humility, bitch.

[dhk1980]

It's not a fluke if the guy is winning the round and Gonzaga was winning convincingly up until that kick.

well guys, u heard it from the emperor. if he says so, then it is so. :lol: no, really.

[Drunken Gamer]

hey DG, you sound really heart broken. didn't u say that during the pride OWGP, u weren standing and jumping and shouting like a kid while crocop put a on a show?? well.... awwwwwwww, you poor baby! :lol:

Yeah, I like Mirko because he is fun to watch. His cardio still sucks, though.



During the match with Wandy, I could see Mirko taking very heavy breaths as the doctor was checking Wandy out. I was thinking, "ok, just take a little bit longer checking that cut so Mirko can catch his breath."

[Drunken Gamer]

If the CroCop that dominated PRIDE turned up, Gonzaga wouldn't of won. I've not lost any respect for CroCop. Everybody has a bad day.

CroCop dominated Pride? When did this happen? Last I heard Fedor was the undefeated HW champ in Pride. Nog also beat him for the interm belt.

[tripwire]

I think even at Mirko's top game Gonzaga takes that fight if he fights like he did last night.

[dhk1980]

Yeah, I like Mirko because he is fun to watch. His cardio still sucks, though.



During the match with Wandy, I could see Mirko taking very heavy breaths as the doctor was checking Wandy out. I was thinking, "ok, just take a little bit longer checking that cut so Mirko can catch his breath."

i don't think mirko looked too old or unwilling to fight. if anything he was too cocky. just like he was when he got KO'd by Randleman

[don king]

i missed the fight and only caught the last 20-30 seconds on dailymotion.com. I say it wasn't a fluke due to one thing: Cro Cop has always impressed me because you don't see the kick coming. That's why he's so effective.

Watching this (http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/cro%2Bcop%2Bgonzaga/video/x1s97k_ufc70nationscollideppvdsripxvidaa) video, Gonzaga does the same thing. That high kick is so fast it comes out of nowhere. I haven't seen him fight before, but based on this one clip alone, he seems to have incredible quickness.

Seems like only Fedor can survive the year of upsets.

[Shamrocked]

Cro Cop has always impressed me because you don't see the kick coming. That's why he's so effective.

Watching this (http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/cro%2Bcop%2Bgonzaga/video/x1s97k_ufc70nationscollideppvdsripxvidaa) video, Gonzaga does the same thing. That high kick is so fast it comes out of nowhere.It looked like Mirko saw it, he just misjudged it. I think he thought it was coming to the body, and was as surprised as everyone else that Gonzaga's soft, sloppy ass could actually get his leg up that high.

[Scott e Dio93]

CroCop lacked respect for Gonzaga kicking abililty. So never seem to be kicked on the head, but ignorance is deadly, so he got his ass kicked by being a dumbass.

I never saw Gonzaga fight until now, I was surprise he's flexible enough to kick that high, Gonzaga doesn't seem like kicker, but I was wrong. Hopefully, Randy won't lose and continue being the Champ, wrestle down Gonzaga and pound him.

[goonplatoon33]

from the way the poll is worded, id say its a combination of both. i think cc would win 9 out of 10 times, but at the same time gonzaga brilliantly executed a great gameplan

[ChiliChris]

Gonzaga by submission or GNP wouldn't be a fluke. However,NOONE thought he'd RHK CroCop to sleep. It was a beautiful kick. Congrats to Gonzaga. IF they fight again,Crocop will KO Gonzaga. CroCop only threw 1 kick to the body and it left a huge bruise. The next one might have broke a rib. Gonzaga catching that body kick was very impressive. None of us have any idea if Gonzaga could take a straight left to his face from CroCop. CroCop hardly did anything. I don't think CroCop liked those elbows. CroCop would've eventually caught Gonzaga and put him to sleep. CroCop will be back. He just needs to fight more aggressively next time. He fought like he didn't even care. You could tell this was Gonzaga's biggest fight of his life. He fought like he really wanted it. CroCop has come back from a fluke punch before. He'll come back from this fluke kick. Next time,there will be no high kicks landing on CroCop's dome. He will be UFC heavyweight champ. He's only 32 yrs old. The only 2 non flukey losses for CroCop were Fedor and Hunt. War CroCop!!!!!

[WI Crippler]

It looked like Mirko saw it, he just misjudged it. I think he thought it was coming to the body, and was as surprised as everyone else that Gonzaga's soft, sloppy ass could actually get his leg up that high.

You can tell from the replay Cro Cop was blocking a kick to the body.....Even if he blocks it, I still think the kick was good enough to stun him, but at least he wouldn't look like he got hit by a roadside bomb....

[Drunken Gamer]

i don't think mirko looked too old or unwilling to fight. if anything he was too cocky. just like he was when he got KO'd by Randleman

Look at his face: he looks old.

[xxTapoutxx]

if cro cop came in witht he right mindset, he wins 9 out of 10 times

if he comes in like he did last night, he loses 9 out of 10 times

[Fedor Fan]

Does anyone remember if Gonzaga was the one that fought Terry Martin in a snooze fest? The one were everybody was booing, Rogan was talking **** and then in the 3rd round Gonzaga ko's Martin. I'm I remembering this right? If so Gonzaga has done a complete 180.

[xxTapoutxx]

Does anyone remember if Gonzaga was the one that fought Terry Martin in a snooze fest? The one were everybody was booing, Rogan was talking **** and then in the 3rd round Gonzaga ko's Martin. I'm I remembering this right? If so Gonzaga has done a complete 180.

it wasnt terry martin

it was kevin jordan( it think thats his name)

[Cbear]

Look at his face: he looks old.

The Pride schedule for the top guys has been insane for the last several years. I can't even count the number of fights Crocop and Silva have averaged per year but its at least twice as much as what the UFC fighters like Chuck average. And while Silva has always been mugly, if you look at his (and Crocops) face today vs 2 years ago, they look 10 years older. Even Josh Barnett is starting to no longer look babyfaced and is showing the wear and tear of a hard schedule. Fedor and Chuck look young because they don't fight that often.

I don't know what to think about Crocop anymore. When he faces world class competition he fights hard, when he fights jobbers he gets knocked out. Is it arrogance...lack of training....lack of mental focus....not giving a damn?

[chrisman]

Gonzaga is listed as a fighter on the Chute Boxe website:

http://www.chuteboxe.com.br/lutadores.html

Maybe that's were he got his kicking ability but I didn't know he was a Chute Boxe fighter. Anybody know what camp he's from?

[WEREWOLF]

My two cents from my failed Mirko Crop Cop Instant Karma thread:

After years of terrorizing the MMA world with his lethal high kicks, someone has finally returned the favor to Mirko Cro Cop.

Mirko seemed very leery of getting into a punching exchange with Gonzaga. Mirko stayed out of punching range which left him at the right distance for a high kick that he obviously didn't expect. End result- Mirko was on the wrong end of a brutal KO. Had Mirko closed distance and used his superior boxing skills the fight may have ended differently.

[GeoffWorldOrder]

I like Mirko and have for a long time like many others on this board.
However, Gonzaga is a ****ing genius for taking it to him the way he did.
No way in hell anyone called Gonzaga by KO via a kick to the head.
Cro-Cop might say he didn't underestimate Gonzaga, but you can tell that he did in a small way. Now he has to live with it.
Total props to Gonzaga for his win, absolutely beautiful.

[BruceLee]

My two cents from my failed Mirko Crop Cop Instant Karma thread:

After years of terrorizing the MMA world with his lethal high kicks, someone has finally returned the favor to Mirko Cro Cop.

Mirko seemed very leery of getting into a punching exchange with Gonzaga. Mirko stayed out of punching range which left him at the right distance for a high kick that he obviously didn't expect. End result- Mirko was on the wrong end of a brutal KO. Had Mirko closed distance and used his superior boxing skills the fight may have ended differently.

If anything, Mirko respected Gonzaga's striking power too much (based on the Jordan fight) which is probably why he kept his distance from Gonzaga. Mirko was probably thinking better not get dropped by a lucky punch a la Randleman.

I honestly think he just didn't think that Gonazaga was capable or flexible enough to execute a High Kick. I'd have to go back and watch Gonazaga's old fights to see if he ever exhibited the high kick.

[BruceLee]

Gonzaga is listed as a fighter on the Chute Boxe website:

http://www.chuteboxe.com.br/lutadores.html

Maybe that's were he got his kicking ability but I didn't know he was a Chute Boxe fighter. Anybody know what camp he's from?

Yeah, early in the UFC, his debut agasint Jordan it was mentioned that he was from Chute Boxe. But then they stopped mentioning it.

I guess he is sort of the Chute Boxe ugly duckling (if there is even such a thing) or reject because he now lives and trains in Massachusettes with another camp.

Come to think of it Anderson Silva was also a Chute Boxe reject and ugly duckling.

[Shamrocked]

Had Mirko closed distance and used his superior boxing skills the fight may have ended differently.So true. As usual though everyone seems to be aware of how good Cro Cop's hands are except Cro Cop.

[TheIcon]

Im trying to figure out what CroCop looking old has to do with anything? I don't care if he has a face like a newborn or a face like an 80 year old keystone light drinker. How old your face looks has no part in how well you perform. He performed poorly and lost. Period. He may look older than 32 at this point but I see college basketball players that look like they could father me.

I also feel the elbows to the head is something he is going to have to get use to. He looked very uncomfortable on his back with elbows coming down.

[Drunken Gamer]

Im trying to figure out what CroCop looking old has to do with anything?

That is because you haven't haven't been keeping up with the conversation from the beginning. :rolleyes:

[moriarty]

I agree with those who say that Mirko just looked uninterested. Ever since he joined the UFC, I just got the impression he was there for a quick paycheck. There was the Pride theme entrance, the skipping of post fight interviews, etc... I couldn't help but feeling a little glee when he got KO'd.

I haven't caught up on all the threads yet, but in the paper (still getting used to reading about MMA in the paper) it mentioned he was considering retirement. I hope not for the fans sake.

Take nothing away from Gonzaga though. I'm starting to fear for Randy's life again.

[TheIcon]

That is because you haven't haven't been keeping up with the conversation from the beginning. :rolleyes:

Pretty sure I have. All I see is CBear saying he looks older in the face and I believe a comment about how it could be stress making him look older. So once again I say who cares how he looks. If anything he looks worse now with 5 toes imprinted on his cranium.

[Drunken Gamer]

Pretty sure I have. All I see is CBear saying he looks older in the face and I believe a comment about how it could be stress making him look older. So once again I say who cares how he looks. If anything he looks worse now with 5 toes imprinted on his cranium.

Then you should know that if he is under a lot of stress and tired of "fighting, training, politics, and traveling" as the Croation newspaper reported a while back then it would absolutely have an effect on his training regime, and his fighting abilities at this point.

What is the confusion here?