Judo Techinques, Tips and Discussion Thread

[BruceLee]

I did Judo for a few years at the Kodokan in Tokyo. I still go every now and again, but I was getting alot of pain in my fingers and wrists (I work as a pianist so this is not an ideal situation) so I havn`t been going lately. Anyway at Kodokan they make you learn breakfalls and proper throwing technique for a couple of months before you can do any randori. It sort of sucked at the time, but I think it really cut down on the chance of injuries. It is often the beginners that get to the randori stage of training that get/cause injuries. It was also a little hard on the foreign guys, because alot of the Japanese students have an image of foreign guys being stronger/bigger than them so they go a bit harder than they usually do. I actually think doing randori with black belts is better for your training - you can learn better technique from them, and they arn`t as caught up in the ego thing, as newer guys.

How strict are they at the Kodokan? I was reading on their website that they use the traditional Japanese method where you just have to grin and bear it and keep training, even if you want to stop.

[BruceLee]

Breakfalls

What is the exact point of slapping your hand on the mat especially since you wouldn't do this out on pavement? (other than it being safe so you don't end up like Shogun agasint Mark Coleman). Does Jigoro Kano ever explain this.

Here is what I have gathered, heard, or have thought of:

1. slapping the hand aligns the shoudler so you don't fall on it wrong
2. it increases the surface area of the fall, thus dissipiating the impact and pressure.
3. it feels nice and is addictive, so that you start to like being thrown and falling to the ground.
4. Psychologically, it takes your attention off the fall, by focusing your attention on the activity of slapping the mat instead of the fear of hitting the ground with your body.

[LiveinTokyo]

The japanese thought of gaman (which basically means to endure) is strong amonst sporty types so they can be pretty hard on themselves. If there is an injury however they take it seriously - they have a first aid room and there some doctors/chiropractors that practice so someone is usually on hand for any major problems.

I always wondered about the hand slapping thing too - I slipped down some wet stairs about a year after starting judo and I instinctively banged both of my hands down to break my fall. I ended up doing alot more damage than if I had fallen normally.

[dwarfofdoom]

would bother with a dummy unless you are practicing suplexs.

Right now I have gone training mad.

Mons: JJJ
Tues:BJJ
Weds:JJJ
Thurs: Running
Friday: Weights
Sat: Judo and BJJ/MMA
Sun: Greco Roman wrestling/weights

I'm thinking of adding another judo session in there somewhere as they want me to grade. Maybe sacrifice Friday weights or weights aftrer judo Theres just not enough hours.

Anyway I can't make my judo grading or the ADCC nationals because my sister in law is giving birth that week (July 12 yay) and she maybe a couple of days early or late.

Breakfalling outside of the dojo is one of the most dangerous things you can do unless its a flat surface. Add stairs or mountains and you are in trouble.

Love judo.

[telerion]

What do you think about making or buying a Judo Dummy to practice with? Is that effective at all. (considering the lack of resistence)?

Also do you use the inner tube or rope around the Tree that Kimura used to use, and Fedor uses now. I think they use it for Seio-Nage but I'm not sure if it can be used for more than just that.

I've never heard of a "Judo Dummy" though I think there might be a few students in our kids class that could fit the bill.

We use an inner tube sometimes for speed uchikomi's (throw fit-in's). It can be useful for practicing both tachi-waza (standing techniques) and koshi-waza (hip techniques). I think the idea is both to get the hand position down (there's quite a bit of difference between seoi-nage and say sode-tsurikomi-goshi) and also for building coordinating muscles (Phys. Ed. people help me with the terminology here pls) in the arms and back for getting good kuzushi.

I'd guess that using an actual uke is better, but I don't know to many people that will volunteer to let me repeatly slam them as hard and fast as I can.

[telerion]

Breakfalls

What is the exact point of slapping your hand on the mat especially since you wouldn't do this out on pavement? (other than it being safe so you don't end up like Shogun agasint Mark Coleman). Does Jigoro Kano ever explain this.

Here is what I have gathered, heard, or have thought of:

1. slapping the hand aligns the shoudler so you don't fall on it wrong
2. it increases the surface area of the fall, thus dissipiating the impact and pressure.
3. it feels nice and is addictive, so that you start to like being thrown and falling to the ground.
4. Psychologically, it takes your attention off the fall, by focusing your attention on the activity of slapping the mat instead of the fear of hitting the ground with your body.

I've done it on pavement and ice, and it's saved my butt on quite a few occasions. The idea is to fall with the minimum amount of injury. If the fall is high enough and/or the surface hard enough, the minimum amount of injury may include a broken hand. The position helps protect your inner organs, back, and head. One of the most common mistakes early on is not tucking your chin. This causes the back of your head to whip into the mat/ground/cement when you fall. You can knock some one out on a mat with a hard throw if they don't tuck. On a cement surface you'd probably put some one in a coma or even kill them with a hard throw. Imagine rushing in and executing osoto-makikomi on pavement. Even if that person knows how to fall they are probably in trouble. An inexperienced person would almost certainly end up in the hospital.

Another mistake I see all the time is uke not slapping and instead either falling on his elbow which can dislocate his shoulder or trying to post out with his hand which can break the elbow.

Edit: Usually when I fall outside I'm moving forward so rather so I do zempo kaiten (forward roll) instead and come up. Falling down a flight of stairs just sucks, and while I'm sure there is a best way to fall down them, it's not something I would practice much. IMO, it's better just to watch your step and use the handrail if possible.

[bigjay]

Injury wise I think judo is much higher than BJJ because of it's emphasis on throws. You're frequently getting thrown down from a height and if you land funny, resist badly, etc you're going to get hurt. Ground work is a lot more controlled and would have less freak injury instances than standing.

Never seen a dummy used and I can't see it really working. Tension lines are alright for uchi-komi if you don't have a partner to work with but people are much better,

Slapping for breakfalls does definately dissipate the impact when you're being thrown on your side, front or back. Rolling breakfalls don't really need it though since you're dissipating the impact with the roll. It's usually preferable to put the brunt of the impact on your arm, plus being prepared and controlling the impact seems to help too.

[BruceLee]

. One of the most common mistakes early on is not tucking your chin. This causes the back of your head to whip into the mat/ground/cement when you fall. You can knock some one out on a mat with a hard throw if they don't tuck. On a cement surface you'd probably put some one in a coma or even kill them with a hard throw. .

I keep forgetting to tuck my head in. when you tuck your head in is your chin supposed to touch your sternum/chest? How far are you supposed to tuck your head in?

[BruceLee]

On breakfalls which is supposed to hit first the arm or body? I assume ideally it is both, but if you had to pick one would it be the body before the arm/hand or vice versa.

I was having problems yesterday when I was being picked up with a double leg takedown and then deposited sideways. I kept trying to do the breakfall but I was coming down too fast so it felt like I was sticking my hand out to postout instead of slapping the mat. (which is absolutely not what you want to do) Also it felt like my hand was hitting the ground way before my body was getting there.

[telerion]

On breakfalls which is supposed to hit first the arm or body? I assume ideally it is both, but if you had to pick one would it be the body before the arm/hand or vice versa.

I was having problems yesterday when I was being picked up with a double leg takedown and then deposited sideways. I kept trying to do the breakfall but I was coming down too fast so it felt like I was sticking my hand out to postout instead of slapping the mat. (which is absolutely not what you want to do) Also it felt like my hand was hitting the ground way before my body was getting there.

Usually my arm hits just a split second before the rest of my body. It can be difficult on some throws though to gauge the timing of the slap, especially high ones. I like to keep my arm(s) across my chest while I fall. This allows me to wait on the slap a bit and fights the instinct to post out. I'd say in practice with the double leg you'd probably be better off slapping late than too early. Unless your partner is really trying to slam you, the double leg isn't a painful throw so a late slap won't hurt much. You can work on the timing from there.

I keep forgetting to tuck my head in. when you tuck your head in is your chin supposed to touch your sternum/chest? How far are you supposed to tuck your head in?

Keep your chin down tight. Don't tuck it so far that you have to really arch your neck or upper back though. Along with good technique buidling strong neck muscle is key. One easy way to build up your neck is just to focus on always keeping your head off the mat during practice. When your doing sit-ups, leg-raises, practicing breakfalls, or whatever, if you're on your back, keep your head up. I remember it sucked at first, but after a while you'll be able to hold your head up the whole time and won't even notice.