Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.

View Poll Results: Your views on abortion?

Voters
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  • Moral and should be legal

    13 59.09%
  • Immoral but should still be legal

    5 22.73%
  • Immoral and illegal.

    1 4.55%
  • Undecided.

    3 13.64%
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  1. Default

    There is protesters who stand outside the local planned parenthood place everyday. Literally every day, even if it is raining. They have signs and all that. Every time I drive past I yell "Abortion rules!" out the window.

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  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by IchiTheKiller View Post
    There is protesters who stand outside the local planned parenthood place everyday. Literally every day, even if it is raining. They have signs and all that. Every time I drive past I yell "Abortion rules!" out the window.

    That's where I go to pick up chicks...

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    Originally Posted by Ash
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    I think all sigs should have a 2 cock minimum.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by IchiTheKiller View Post
    There is protesters who stand outside the local planned parenthood place everyday. Literally every day, even if it is raining. They have signs and all that. Every time I drive past I yell "Abortion rules!" out the window.
    At the nearest clinic to me, some pro-choice group put up a sign that says every day pro-life protesters show up to picket, they'll make a donation to the clinic. I thought, "That's a great way to get a tax break!"

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallica1981 View Post
    For those who find abortion to be moral (or at least not immoral), I'm curious to know how many have been through the process of becoming a parent? I don't just mean have a kid, but rather been through the whole thing. Doctor's appointments, sonograms, etc.

    To many, it appears this is just another "individual rights" issue and nothing more. There seems to be no thought or concern with the fact that it does involve a life.

    When I say it should be legal (something I'm not comfortable saying) I'm doing it based more on social and economic reasons than I am based on feeling like government should butt out. To me a woman's right to choose is great and all, but that seems like a gross over simplification of a much more complex issue. We're not talking about choosing to vote, or choosing your sexual preference, but something even more critical.

    On a side note, for those bringing up having tubes tied (joking or not) do we really need to do it on the 4th one!? How about #2?
    Sure. Both times I went through the whole thing. First time was an unexpected pregnancy too. Like I wrote on the first page, I think it requires more than just establishing that a fetus is alive (or even a person) to conclude that it's immoral to terminate it.

    BTW I used to not feel this way (ironically, I changed my mind well after both of my daughters were born), so I appreciate your respect for life. I say this because sometimes things come off wrong on the Internet.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by telerion View Post
    Sure. Both times I went through the whole thing. First time was an unexpected pregnancy too. Like I wrote on the first page, I think it requires more than just establishing that a fetus is alive (or even a person) to conclude that it's immoral to terminate it.

    BTW I used to not feel this way (ironically, I changed my mind well after both of my daughters were born), so I appreciate your respect for life. I say this because sometimes things come off wrong on the Internet.
    Interesting. I'd be curious to know what you feel is necessary to establish morality in this issue. If establishing life isn't the only thing to determine the morality, what other factors do you feel play a role in that decision in a normal healthy pregnancy? I fully understand and agree with the notion that the life of the mother should take precedence, as well as agree that circumstances involving rape or near certainty of the child being still born, etc. are more than justification for the procedure.

    Also, is there anything that you can point to that swayed your opinion on the issue after the birth of your children?

    I've been very flip floppy on this issue throughout my life. Being raised Catholic, I used to absolutely detest the thought of abortion. As I grew up and away from my faith, there was almost a complete 180 on many of my views in order to establish my separation from my previous faith. Possibly just a reaction to feeling like the dogma I was raised to believe was mostly crap. Seems a bit of an overreaction. Now that I have been through more and have had the chance to not feel pulled to either side of the issue, I have settled near the middle.

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  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by angrybill View Post
    that's where i go to pick up chicks...

    hahahahaha!!!!

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  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallica1981 View Post
    Interesting. I'd be curious to know what you feel is necessary to establish morality . . . As I grew up and away from my faith, there was almost a complete 180 on many of my views in order to establish my separation from my previous faith. Possibly just a reaction to feeling like the dogma I was raised to believe was mostly crap. Seems a bit of an overreaction. Now that I have been through more and have had the chance to not feel pulled to either side of the issue, I have settled near the middle.
    From my IPhone so please bear with me.

    I know it's been awhile but I drop by here much anymore.

    Let me say first that my current views on this issue and my daughters' births are completely unrelated. I was just saying that despite my experiences with them, I don't think abortion is immoral.

    Now how do you decide what is moral? That's a very hard question. Given that eminent philosophers still debate this after several thousand years of deep thought, I'm not under any pretense that I'll offer a satisfactory answer here. Nevertheless, I will give a justification: in my opinion the consideration of the mother's welfare is more compelling than that of the zygote/embryo/fetus. We make these sorts of judgements all the time. You could start with other animals. I kill flies at will. Why? Because they are a nuisance. This is compelling enough for me (as it is for most people). How about a pig? No. I don't feel like I should kill a pig if it is a nuisance unless it is endangering my life. But what about eating it? Sure. Then it's justified.

    Let's move this forward to something more pertinent. A human being. When can I justify killing a human being? Certainly there are cases, though never for being a nuisance. For food? Only in the most dire of situations. How about in a war? Maybe. If they are an enemy soldier or incidental, unfortunate, yet necessary, collateral damage. A lot of people here would agree that it's okay to kill in self-defense (some even to protect minor possessions). Capital punishment. Taking a loved one off of a machine. Putting a dying and severely suffering person out of there misery. I think a lot of us could justify some or all of these actions. And I don't even put a zygot/embryo/fetus on par with a born human.

    Of those that do not support abortion, some still support disposing off fertilized eggs at fertility clinics. In your own statement you feel termination is justified in the case of rape.

    My point is that life alone is not sufficient to rule out termination. Circumstances matter as well. I think until birth the mother's wishes dominate. That may seem arbitrary, and it is. Just like conception is. I pick birth not because something magic happens then, but rather because it is a clear delineation. After birth there could still be circumstances where termination is justified, but the mother's wishes are no longer compelling in my view.

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by telerion View Post
    From my IPhone so please bear with me.

    I know it's been awhile but I drop by here much anymore.

    Let me say first that my current views on this issue and my daughters' births are completely unrelated. I was just saying that despite my experiences with them, I don't think abortion is immoral.

    Now how do you decide what is moral? That's a very hard question. Given that eminent philosophers still debate this after several thousand years of deep thought, I'm not under any pretense that I'll offer a satisfactory answer here. Nevertheless, I will give a justification: in my opinion the consideration of the mother's welfare is more compelling than that of the zygote/embryo/fetus. We make these sorts of judgements all the time. You could start with other animals. I kill flies at will. Why? Because they are a nuisance. This is compelling enough for me (as it is for most people). How about a pig? No. I don't feel like I should kill a pig if it is a nuisance unless it is endangering my life. But what about eating it? Sure. Then it's justified.

    Let's move this forward to something more pertinent. A human being. When can I justify killing a human being? Certainly there are cases, though never for being a nuisance. For food? Only in the most dire of situations. How about in a war? Maybe. If they are an enemy soldier or incidental, unfortunate, yet necessary, collateral damage. A lot of people here would agree that it's okay to kill in self-defense (some even to protect minor possessions). Capital punishment. Taking a loved one off of a machine. Putting a dying and severely suffering person out of there misery. I think a lot of us could justify some or all of these actions. And I don't even put a zygot/embryo/fetus on par with a born human.

    Of those that do not support abortion, some still support disposing off fertilized eggs at fertility clinics. In your own statement you feel termination is justified in the case of rape.

    My point is that life alone is not sufficient to rule out termination. Circumstances matter as well. I think until birth the mother's wishes dominate. That may seem arbitrary, and it is. Just like conception is. I pick birth not because something magic happens then, but rather because it is a clear delineation. After birth there could still be circumstances where termination is justified, but the mother's wishes are no longer compelling in my view.
    Good post.

    I understand your reasoning, but I do pause at a few of the points you make. For the sake of this argument, I think it only makes sense to keep this in the context of human life. Obviously when discussing the morality of life and death in this situation, it only makes sense to stick with human life.

    I agree with your statement that "life alone is not sufficient to rule out termination." However, I think it is an essential part of this debate when determining the morality of the procedure. There are certainly times when terminating a life is justified by most. I struggle to agree with the premise that a "mother's wishes" super cede any potential ethical boundaries than can be established when concerning a human life. I have a hard time saying definitively that conception is the point at which we can say life begins, but I don't feel as though it is as arbitrary a concept as a mother's wishes. I don't think there is ever another another time when a personal preference takes precedence over a life.

    I'm not saying that the life and well being of a willing female in a pregnancy should not take priority over a fetus, but when the woman was a willing participant in the act that resulted in the pregnancy, and is in no imminent danger as a result of it, her, or her mate's personal wishes might need to take a back seat to a more ethical and moral standard

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  9. #89
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    The only people who get abortions seem to be white chicks whose families have money. The po folks of all. Colors just pop them out letting medicaid pay and then dump them on maw maw and paw paw to raise

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    Repent Ash, repent!

  10. #90

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    Should be legal. Not anyones business if a woman/couple make that choice.

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    @jedigavin

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