Are republicans trying to steal the election in Florida? (Again)

[Thumpin]

Essentially the state has thrown them off the rolls, unless they (the registered voters) find out about this in time, and take the steps to reinstate themselves. This violates the laws in two ways (they didn't get pre-approval as the voting rights act demands) and they did it too close to an election.

The federal government should in no way shape or form give them any cooperation with this. Name matching for Hispanics is a major headache as anyone who's ever grown up in an hispanic community can tell you. Between using two last names, hyphens, and discrepancies such as De la Rosa v. Delarosa, the GOP just wants room to pretend what they are doing is legitimate.

Name matching for Hispanics is a headache?? It's the Homeland Security database - you match names with social security numbers, address, passport info, visa/green card info, death records, location records. Not very hard to do at all - I work in the industry where data mining is highly prevalent and it's not difficult at all to tune database searches to validate information. The government even has one to help businesses check status on citizenship as well for hiring (e-Verify). If the Feds don't help states with this, there's no chance states will ever be able to validate citizenship.

As for picture ID's "being a burden", I will accept that argument for those who have no bank account, cash no government welfare check, receive no unemployment checks, do not purchase OTC medicines that require ID, never travel on planes, do not drive a car, and are smart enough to register to vote but not smart enough to get a picture ID. If the cost of a picture ID is too great, I expect that small population not to be wasting their money on drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, cell phones, jewelry, acrylic nails, or designer fashion wear (hats, shoes, sports gear wear, etc), and they do not send money overseas. Given that, how many people does it disenfranchise? Not many, I would think.

As I said above...the problem is they're doing it 90 days before the primaries, which is in violation of the law.

[Spectre]

Name matching for Hispanics is a headache?? It's the Homeland Security database - you match names with social security numbers, address, passport info, visa/green card info, death records, location records. Not very hard to do at all - I work in the industry where data mining is highly prevalent and it's not difficult at all to tune database searches to validate information. The government even has one to help businesses check status on citizenship as well for hiring (e-Verify). If the Feds don't help states with this, there's no chance states will ever be able to validate citizenship.

As for picture ID's "being a burden", I will accept that argument for those who have no bank account, cash no government welfare check, receive no unemployment checks, do not purchase OTC medicines that require ID, never travel on planes, do not drive a car, and are smart enough to register to vote but not smart enough to get a picture ID. If the cost of a picture ID is too great, I expect that small population not to be wasting their money on drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, cell phones, jewelry, acrylic nails, or designer fashion wear (hats, shoes, sports gear wear, etc), and they do not send money overseas. Given that, how many people does it disenfranchise? Not many, I would think.

As I said above...the problem is they're doing it 90 days before the primaries, which is in violation of the law.

As I said before, it's not just "ID" it's which ones. College IDs can be state-issued photo ID, but they don't accept them in Texas.

Up to 11% of voters in this country don't have the "adequate" ID That's tens of millions of voters that your party wants to silence.

[Spectre]

Also keep in mind, Florida is a state that in the 2000 election, got caught purging thousands of black people from the voter rolls. The governor, coincidentally, was George W. Bush's brother. Bush ended up winning the state by a few hundred votes.

[Thumpin]

As I said before, it's not just "ID" it's which ones. College IDs can be state-issued photo ID, but they don't accept them in Texas.

Up to 11% of voters in this country don't have the "adequate" ID That's tens of millions of voters that your party wants to silence.

I've seen that study, and it's up to 11% of eligible voters, not registered voters.

Wants to silence? I guess that's one way of looking at it. It's making sure the votes that are "silenced" are the ones that shouldn't be voting in the first place, and validating those that should be. I have a hard time believing it is a burden unless the people fall into the small category I mentioned above (no bank account, cash no government welfare check, receive no unemployment checks, do not purchase OTC medicines that require ID, never travel on planes, do not drive a car, are smart enough to register to vote but not smart enough to get a picture ID, and they are not wasting their money on drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, cell phones, jewelry, acrylic nails, or designer fashion wear (hats, shoes, sports gear wear, etc), or sending money overseas).

[Spectre]

I've seen that study, and it's up to 11% of eligible voters, not registered voters.

Wants to silence? I guess that's one way of looking at it. It's making sure the votes that are "silenced" are the ones that shouldn't be voting in the first place, and validating those that should be. I have a hard time believing it is a burden unless the people fall into the small category I mentioned above (no bank account, cash no government welfare check, receive no unemployment checks, do not purchase OTC medicines that require ID, never travel on planes, do not drive a car, are smart enough to register to vote but not smart enough to get a picture ID, and they are not wasting their money on drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, cell phones, jewelry, acrylic nails, or designer fashion wear (hats, shoes, sports gear wear, etc), or sending money overseas).

Now you're just repeating yourself without having read anything. That's a shame. Your post is invalid because you can do pretty much all those things, with varying forms of photo ids or none at all. You can open a bank account with a utility bill and an old passport. You can cash your checks without a bank account. You never get asked for any id when buying OTC medicines. On the few items that you do, pharmacists will take anything with a picture, regardless of whether it's state sponsored. Also people have family that can do all this for them.

And with all that, facts are facts, 11% of people in this country would be disenfranchised if you had your way. I'm not sure why you responded with "those are just eligible!!" since that's irrelevant.


Finally, I rechecked the study. That's just people who lack picture ID! Plenty of millions more have picture ID (such as millions of college students), that would be invalid in states like Texas. That's why the republican voter id movement (backed by rich anti-democratic interests) is so problematic.

Democracy is what this country's principles claim to be based on. When your proposed legislation would disenfranchise 50+ million people, you lose. Full stop.

[Spectre]

The Florida election supervisors are also against continuing the purge:

(CNN) – The legal counsel for Florida's local elections officers has recommended all counties in the state stop removing names from their voter rolls after the U.S. Department of Justice questioned the legality of the action.

In a recommendation dated June 1, Ron Labasky, a lawyer for the Florida State Association of Supervisors of Elections, advised all counties to stop the removal of names from the voter rolls until the Justice Department's concerns are resolved.

The Department of Justice wrote in a letter Thursday that Florida failed to properly notify the federal government of their decision, writing the unilateral move violated provisions of the Voting Rights Act of 1965.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...test-from-doj/

[Thumpin]

Now you're just repeating yourself without having read anything. That's a shame. Your post is invalid because you can do pretty much all those things, with varying forms of voter ids or none at all. You can open a bank account with a utility bill and an old passport. You can cash your checks without a bank account. You never get asked for any id when buying OTC medicines. On the few items that you do, pharmacists will take anything with a picture, regardless of whether it's state sponsored. Also people have family that can do all this for them.

Oh, I'm sure you can find ways to do all these things if you really try.

Financial institutions are required by law to have a Customer Identification Program for the creation of new accounts. A new account may include, but is not limited to, a deposit account, an extension of credit, or the rental of a safe deposit box.

The minimum information that a bank must obtain when opening a new account includes—

• name,
• date of birth (for an individual),
• address, and
• identification number (for U.S. citizens, a taxpayer identification number is defined as the individual's Social Security number or employer identification number).

The bank must then verify the accuracy of the information via a review of documents such as a driver's license or passport. Or it can verify the information by comparing the information you provided with information from a credit-reporting agency or by checking prior bank references. So...if you have a credit report of some kind, your account can be validated. A lot goes on behind the scenes when you give the bank documentation.

Want to cash a check without a bank account or ID? Sure...you can do it for a nice fee at Money Mart. But then you can take that ongoing fee you pay every time you cash a check and get a Photo ID too. You can sign a check over to a family member or someone that has the above as well.

You can get on a plane without a driver's license or photo ID...I've done it. But it was a pain in the butt and required about 20 minutes of TSA verifying who I was based on everything else in my wallet.

State issued photo ID's cost anywhere from $20 to $70. Please tell me you're not saying that there would be close to 50 million people in the US of voting age that can register to vote, are interested in voting (thus the eligible vs registered voters...you can't be disenfranchised if you don't give a crap about voting), go out of their way to function without a photo ID, and cannot afford a photo ID (and don't waste their cash on fluff) that would be disenfranchised....

My problem with this is that they do this about two months before an election, when everyone knows getting a photo ID can take quite some time from the DMV.


PS: This past decade, many states have required those purchasing drugs containing pseudoephedrine (Sudafed) to show a photo ID to purchase the drug and limit the amount a customer can buy within a certain timeframe. My state is one of them.

[Cbear]

Colleges accept foreign nationals and issue the id. Thus, you cant accept that as proof of citizenship. CCL licenses can only be issued to citizens and ba kgrounds are checked by the feebs which is a much more thorough vetting process that what the admin off a college is going to do. If someone has a ccl license, the fee s have their fingerprints on file and know exactly who they are---contrasted with an illegal who got a fake ss number and id from the local flea market

[Spectre]

Colleges accept foreign nationals and issue the id. Thus, you cant accept that as proof of citizenship. CCL licenses can only be issued to citizens and ba kgrounds are checked by the feebs which is a much more thorough vetting process that what the admin off a college is going to do. If someone has a ccl license, the fee s have their fingerprints on file and know exactly who they are---contrasted with an illegal who got a fake ss number and id from the local flea market

College IDs are valid personal identification though. And if you're not a citizen you can't register to vote. So if Jon Smith is a citizen, he can register. The college ID proves that Jon Smith is the real Jon Smith.

The only reason to prevent college IDs, but allow gun permits, is because gun folks like republicans, and students tend not to.

[Spectre]

Oh, I'm sure you can find ways to do all these things if you really try.

Financial institutions are required by law to have a Customer Identification Program for the creation of new accounts. A new account may include, but is not limited to, a deposit account, an extension of credit, or the rental of a safe deposit box.

The minimum information that a bank must obtain when opening a new account includes—

• name,
• date of birth (for an individual),
• address, and
• identification number (for U.S. citizens, a taxpayer identification number is defined as the individual's Social Security number or employer identification number).

The bank must then verify the accuracy of the information via a review of documents such as a driver's license or passport. Or it can verify the information by comparing the information you provided with information from a credit-reporting agency or by checking prior bank references. So...if you have a credit report of some kind, your account can be validated. A lot goes on behind the scenes when you give the bank documentation.

Want to cash a check without a bank account or ID? Sure...you can do it for a nice fee at Money Mart. But then you can take that ongoing fee you pay every time you cash a check and get a Photo ID too. You can sign a check over to a family member or someone that has the above as well.

You can get on a plane without a driver's license or photo ID...I've done it. But it was a pain in the butt and required about 20 minutes of TSA verifying who I was based on everything else in my wallet.

State issued photo ID's cost anywhere from $20 to $70. Please tell me you're not saying that there would be close to 50 million people in the US of voting age that can register to vote, are interested in voting (thus the eligible vs registered voters...you can't be disenfranchised if you don't give a crap about voting), go out of their way to function without a photo ID, and cannot afford a photo ID (and don't waste their cash on fluff) that would be disenfranchised....

My problem with this is that they do this about two months before an election, when everyone knows getting a photo ID can take quite some time from the DMV.


PS: This past decade, many states have required those purchasing drugs containing pseudoephedrine (Sudafed) to show a photo ID to purchase the drug and limit the amount a customer can buy within a certain timeframe. My state is one of them.

See, you can have valid photo ids, that many of these voter id laws prevent. People have expired passports all the time that work as functional IDs. Same with college IDs. Plenty of housewives have no need for IDs, because the accounts aren't in their name. I used to work at a pharmacy, and I can tell you that the ID checking is a joke. Likewise as long as one person in your family has an ID, you can just get them to do it.

That's why 11% of voters don't have a photo ID. But even beyond that, the voter ID laws the GOP is pushing don't accept all forms of voter ID. They demand very specific ones that many people have no need for.

So when you add all that up, in a country as big as this, 15% will still be over 40 million people.